[T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry)

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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par Gamer2002 » Mar Août 07, 2018 8:24 pm

Spoiler : SoC :
Wright leaves Borscht Bowl Club and the place turns into crime mobs meetup place, I see.

Goddammit, Plum. Don’t be You Had No Goddamn Reason To Not Tell Me More Sooner Tier client.

Starting off with three gavel slams, eh?

Not proper transition at the start and end of testimony.

I wrote in the autopsy report that it was pretty obvious he was dead of blood loss – You are a coroner now, Ema?

Let’s kidnap Udgy to have a natural mediator during gangs negotiation. I’m amazed, Plum.

Lol passage sealed.

Olga is the Club’s owner now?

If she conveniently sealed the passage, she is a likely mastermind.

Anyway, Klavier is really strangely aggressive, but I see Apollo notices it as well. Still, you are the last person to call anyone a lackey, Gavin.

The contradiction that the ring isn’t meaningless is too much of grasping straws to my liking.

I hope there is a decent payoff for Klavier being so aggressive.

Well, the branching path? Udgy is going to testify against Plum cuz he got somehow fooled, but Plum is a You Had No Goddamn Reason To Not Tell Me More Sooner Tier client. Sigh, let’s make her talk.

... I REALLY hope there is a decent payoff for Klavier hiding that his most reliable witness was wearing a blindfold.

Oh, so we are switching witnesses.

Just because he heard them doesn’t mean they weren’t recorded.

Yep, Apollo can be upset about people not telling him things. SoJ didn’t happen yet ;P

Wocky’s portion was fast. Good.

Viola’s theme is great.

Lol Meekins.

How did you get back into the force?

Nobody opened the can to notice the knife inside? I know AA police and all, but come on, Ema was investigating.

Why I can’t call Orly, given that Sunday contacts people with control over the crime scene? She is the crime scene’s owner.

Alright, the evidence -> witness route remains bugged, so I do it the other way around.

Anyway, I more and more think that Klavier is Sunday.

Oh, so he was just blackmailed? I know he was a prick for long, but the change of heart itself happened quickly. But if not Klavier is Sunday than who? Edgeworth? Judge? Meekins?

Dee and Yogi? Well, that has potential.

So, Yogi is trusted by Sunday? If somebody besides Edgeworth can be connected to Yogi, it is the Judge due to Yogi being a former bailiff.

... Well, we could already deduce that Yogi knows Sunday from Dee telling us that Yogi meet with him personally in prison.

Welp, and Sunday poisoned Yogi.

Phoenix ex machina.

So Udgy Bro is the final boss?

Evil Udgy Bro sprites are great.

Blackout scene was great, just like the “LOLOLOL JUDGES CONSTANTLY TOUCH EVIDENCE”


For a first case, it was really impressive. There are still few things to fix (I noticed that Apollo’s mouth wasn’t speaking at some point and he popped up hovering over the witness stand during one of Plum’s testimonies), and there are some kinda rushed scenes characterization wise or logic wise.

Spoiler : more in depth-review :
I speak mostly about how we rushed to THE KILLER HAS TO BE SUNDAY route without... Anything much. I know, bluffing is AA way of thinking, but that scene looked more like some sort of deduction and I didn’t get the basic of it. Maybe I overlooked something, dunno.

Besides that, Klavier’s arc was... Okay. That for him at stake it wasn’t just career, but also Kristoph getting executed sooner, was solid enough. From what I saw, most fans assume that Klavier just hated Kristoph, but for me that’s a) boring and b) contradicts with the fact he, for seven years, sat on the knowledge of Kristoph being Zak’s original attorney that warned him about Phoenix, while Kristoph moved on acting as Wright’s friend.

Evil Udgy Bro was great and his motive was solid and brilliantly based on established continuity. Phoenix was okay, but there wasn’t much of any arc for him. There was stuff I liked, like Wocky taking the fall for his mother, even if in the most idiotic way imaginable, and Yogi giving up easily. But with tons of witnesses not many had a chance to shine and the only good ones were Viola, and (of all people) Meekins. Viola was well written, felt like a character with own agenda and even turned out to be essential to catching her grandfather’s real killer. As for Meekins, he was an original usage of the character and the only accomplice that didn’t join the villain because “lol we are stock bad guys from previous cases anyway”.

Udgy wasn't bad either, but he is the biggest problem with the plot I have. Okay, Plum can be crazy enough to think kidnapping him for a meeting with another criminal is a good enough idea. But how did Evil Udgy could know that Wocky wouldn't do the kidnapping job personally? The entire plan relied on the real Udgy showing up way too early and unsupervised, but that happening was due to the out of anybody's control Wocky. Which means that the crime could be plotted only due to a reaction to Wocky's actions. Wasn't that too little time to plan something so elaborate?

As for Apollo, he had an arc and a chance to shine against very strong enemy. He was good enough. I don’t say that anything particularly bad was about him, just nothing mind blowing (like Evul Judge was).

And I had to re-read SoC to remind myself that Ema was there. Though she had some good moment, but then she disappeared completely.

Perhaps things with characters would look better if you added standard AA epilogue, that showed more in detail what was up with everyone else.


Don’t get discouraged due to the bugs. It is your first trial here, and you still pulled ton of nonstandard cross-examinations. It’s already a solid 7/10 case, and has potential for more. Definitely the best author’s very first case I’m aware of.
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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par Blizdi » Mer Août 08, 2018 9:25 pm

About this thing that Gamer2002 said:

Spoiler : spoiler for case :
But how did Evil Udgy could know that Wocky wouldn't do the kidnapping job personally? The entire plan relied on the real Udgy showing up way too early and unsupervised, but that happening was due to the out of anybody's control Wocky. Which means that the crime could be plotted only due to a reaction to Wocky's actions.


An easy band-aid fix to that is to add something like
Spoiler : case :
Wocky saying how "everyone knows Gs like me get lackies to do my work, aint never done a kidnapping personally. They always finish the job ahead of schedule, ya feel me" to make the plan less reliant on pure circumstance

or something like that
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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par Gamer2002 » Mer Août 08, 2018 11:11 pm

Spoiler : :
I think simpler and more sure explanation for that is Evil Udgy Bro having his people among Wocky's underlings. Wocky is an idiot, so it's a child play to manipulate him into leaving things to his own henchmen. And because of the bug, the kidnapping idea could be known in advance enough.
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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par drvonkitty » Dim Août 19, 2018 6:17 pm

I've come across a bug and I don't think I can continue the game until it's fixed, unless I'm mistaken.

Spoiler : bug :
After presenting the crime report on Viola's first testimony, there's a bug at Frame 2295. You merge two frames together here while doing a smooth scroll. It's a known bugthat merging two frames before the smooth scroll completes will break the display, causing the sprites to stop appearing correctly. I'm not sure if this is a new bug or if this is just an optional present, but if this is the path I have to take to continue, I don't think I can until it's fixed. Based on the editor, it seems like I'm supposed to continue on to another testimony from here.
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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par butterflyeffect » Lun Août 20, 2018 10:10 am

Spoiler : :
I am stuck on the judges second testimony. I can't seem to crack it.

Edit: I eventually did find the issue, so I no longer need help with this. I guess reviewing it again with a fresh mind helped me out.
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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par bigwins » Lun Août 20, 2018 8:25 pm

Hmm drvonkitty, that is the only path through the game and no one's reported that happening at that frame.
For me, it's always done the scroll, and played the following merged frame with no issues.

However, many people have reported that specific problem showing up in many different areas, always as a result of clicking ahead during the bezier transitions. I took out the scroll in that specific instance, so it should be fixed, though because I didn't encounter an issue testing it, it doesn't really bode well for the rest of the case. I'll have to take another look through.
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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par drvonkitty » Lun Août 20, 2018 9:01 pm

I am bad about clicking through frames sometimes, and I'm willing to bet that's it. Essentially, the bug happens if the player reaches the second frame before the scroll is complete. Fast clicking would cause that to happen when it otherwise wouldn't. That would explain why only I got the issue. (Until the bug is fixed, though, I'd stay away from doing scrolls+merged frames if possible.)

My save works now though, so I'll keep playing through when I get a chance! Thank you for the fix!
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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par ItsAllAboutTheTruth » Sam Sep 01, 2018 7:22 pm

I don't really know how to describe this, but this case was REALLY GOOD, it entertained me all the way through until its end, congratulations for your great debut case! I hope we see more of you in the future!

I only have a few suggestions for you to consider in the future:

Spoiler : :
You might want to give your main character a little more development or just make him/her more determined, The way Apollo was basically giving up when having to face most difficult situations was rather off-character for him, but i wouldn't have a problem with it if he had a strong reason for it, the only time Apollo really "gave up" on a client was with Athena on D.D, and even then, he quickly recovered from it and regained his resolve. Also, it wouldn't have bothered me that much if Phoenix's words had actually had an effect on Apollo and he didn't need to be reminded every now and then that he's supposed to trust and fight for his client until the bitter end.
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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par DarkNinja505 » Mer Oct 10, 2018 2:55 pm

So I'm stuck eternally on the second problem of the Plum-Judge double cross-exam, and I need a little help.

Um, help?

EDIT: I don't know how, but that actually made me think about it a little more. The one thing that puzzled me was that
Spoiler : This important stuff :
I thought the two wounds written on the autopsy report were caused by a thorough stab. Maybe I should've looked at the blood on the katana...


And after that I pulled through the rest of the case just fine.
Dernière édition par DarkNinja505 le Jeu Oct 11, 2018 4:57 pm, édité 2 fois.
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Re: [T] Turnabout Underworld (Jam Entry) 

Message par bigwins » Jeu Oct 11, 2018 3:33 am

Start pressing the Judge's statements, and pay close attention to what he says.
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