[CE][T][SoJ♫] Turnabout in Payne and Suffering ●

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Gosicrystal
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Re: [CE][T][SoJ♫] Turnabout in Payne and Suffering ●

Post by Gosicrystal »

I finished this case today. It was pretty good!
Spoiler : Things to praise :
1. I love how it started humorous, but got suddenly dark in the end. I like a bit of both things in my mystery stories, and this one handled it well.

2. Very good music. High quality, good to listen, appropriate for each moment, touching... So good!

3. Excellent use of graphics/interface! The Thought Route in particular was top-notch. It looks and feels quite professional.

4. Well played with Hurte's rebuttal part! It's fair to do what you did because the player can get out of the CE without penalizing themselves to death if they are cautious enough - which is what I like about cross-examinations that look daunting but can be completed by pressing everything. It's mildly devilish, but fair.
Spoiler : Things to complain about :
1. I don't wholly like the idea of forcing the player to lose on purpose... It's like a line that should never be crossed, in my opinion. Or maybe it's a grey area. I don't know, but I always frown upon cases that expect the player to lose. It sort of makes sense in this story, but... yeah.

2. When you are asked who can confirm that the cell phone was only there around the time of the crime (right after finding a contradiction in De Killer's first CE), presenting Larry Butz should not issue a penalty. I thought the court could just call him for a quick question. I understand that you don't want the story to go that way, but at the very least it shouldn't penalize the player for making a reasonable assumption.

3. I can't remember, but apparently Halling said there's a key to the backdoor and only he has access to it. This is important late on the trial, but without nothing mentioning this in the court record, it feels unfair. I know many authors like to expect players to remember small details from early on to use later on, but this makes it very frustrating for the player if they don't remember. It's one of those things I would personally never use in my cases.

4. So small a complaint, it may be nitpicking: I would've preferred if the Thought Route had sticked to the official games and issued no penalties for choosing the wrong options. It's a personal preference of mine - I like to almost blindly speculate in this thought process rather than doing flawless choosing. It's more fun for me.
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Re: [CE][T][SoJ♫] Turnabout in Payne and Suffering ●

Post by Tiagofvarela »

Beeeh, waaah, oooooh, urrrrgh, geeeeh.
That took a turn for the unexpected.
Spoiler : SoC :
Started this like a month ago, wasn't really feeling it, trying again.
Nice bailiff.
"He's really thought this out, hasn't he?" Yes. What a genius this prosecutor is, Payne.
"The mere image of the crime horrifies me to this day!" That makes sense, yeah.
Need to keep the mind record tidy.
The owner goes to the storeroom, which is the most distant place from the front door. I think it fair to present the bell here.
The bell might have rung in tandem with the scream?
Now, now, bailiff. What about the tragic backstory?
Wow. The owner of the phone came into Hurte's office? In this short recess? Where's Hurte's office? The janitor's cupboard?
When I presented Oldbag as someone who might know if the toilets are cleaned daily the penalty sound played but my health was not reduced.
Oh, the radio. Oh, the radio... Heh.
de Killer was the phone. Yet the phone is now in the court record.
Ah. Very well thought out. For more impact, I'd consider making the phone disappear from the court-record the second the prosecutor notices the problem. Assuming it won't be used any more.
Oh. Oh. I have no words.
Spoiler : Thoughts :
Too dark for me. Nope nope nope nope nope nope.
It's amazing how the case does indeed make sense, but the direction it goes in... oh, boy. What a whoozy.
I'm sad now.

Thought route was very well done.
The maps as well as the markers and the way you could even make them move, very good.

Character-wise I have no particular opinions.

The name of the case is bloody accurate, though.
A Laggy Turnabout ★
A Batty Turnabout ★
A Tricky Turnabout ★
Upcoming: A Worldly Turnabout, A Courtly Turnabout, A Clumsy Turnabout, A Needy Turnabout
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Southern Corn
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Re: [CE][T][SoJ♫] Turnabout in Payne and Suffering ●

Post by Southern Corn »

Might just be me, but
Spoiler : :
On replaying, the phone doesn't disappear when pointed out.
Still a 10/10 case in my book though. Here's an SoC with a friend from about a month back. His comments are in italics and mine in bold. Keep in mind this is the original version with the
Spoiler : :
anticlimax ending
and all. Anyway, here we go!
Spoiler : SoC :
Excuse me if I don't respond too fast.
I'm playing this amazing AA fancase where you play as Payne.

wat
WHAT

I am loving it so far
I can't wait to find out why Winston became a DA
oh my god
GASPEN IS THE DEFENDANT

Wat XD
You should play it for yourself, really XD
"(Also, he's always been somewhat more successful than me, as much as I hate to admit it.)"
Psshh, nah, Winny, you've always been better.
At least you're honest.
"I have an image to maintain, after all!" -Winston "Rookie Killer" Payne

What is this XD
Oh shoot
The victim isn't dead
"I forgot, which one of us had the 7-year win streak again?"
OHHHHHHHHH
Nice one, Winston!
The bailiff just called me a loser
The prosecution is just Edgeworth in an orange suit

um
'Wilston Hurte'
Is his actual name
And he has a pretty cool theme
*picture of Hurte enclosed here*

No, that's not Edgeworth in an orange suit.
That's something much, much more.

Edgeworth in an orange suit, a blue tie and Winston's body?
LOOK AT THAT JAWLINE
Woooooow
Beautiful
"A model in-training, Larry Butz has been beaten to near unconsiousness at a nearby bar."
LARRY WAS THE VICTIM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
WHY DIDN'T HE ACTUALLY DIEEEEEEE

You know I'm glad I'm not playing this XD
"I cannot even bring myself to describe it... so here's a report that will do it for me instead."
10/10 case
The witness's name is Constantine
Gaspen also is an alcoholic
Which is the motive
And Larry decided to pull a prank on him
Dang
I dunno man, justifiable crime here
He slipped SUGAR in his beer!
too much
oh no
OLDBAG IS ALSO A WITNESS

Was gonna say.
I kind of expected her to be.

She's Constantine's bodyguard.
Arguably doing a better job than Dale :p
Winston: (Just kill me... this is going to be one very long day, isn't it.)
Winston's "Hold It" is goddamn demonic XD
Puts Manfred's to shame.
I just figured out Oldbag's contradiction.
Oldbag claimed that she calmed down Gaspen and Larry
The contradiction is
"IF YOU CALMED THEM DOWN, HOW DID HE END UP GETTING ASSAULTED!?"
10/10 contradiction

whoa
Winston's Take That is even better than his Hold It XD
Well, be careful about that :p
Hurte is giving a rebuttal
You cannot press, only present
The solution is to do nothing, see the co-counsel talk and proceed through there
It's a lovely case.
And you also have to admit your theory is flawed

?
Oh XD
So you have to do Payne things :p

Nah
He says the prosecution is misleading everyone
And it still doesn't explain why Constantine never called the cops
Basically, his excuse is this
"I used Mr. Butz's cellphone to call the cops"
"But I didn't tell them the address"
Judge: "My poor head can't take anymore of this..."

Is this just designed to be the most annoying case XD
It says as much in the OP :p
"So this is the entry for "The Best Worst Comp Ever" competition, designed to be pretty much as dumb as possible while still being fun."

Nice XD
This is why I'm even playing it XD
Whoa
Apparently someone's blood is on Winston's hands
And Gaspen is upset about it
oh
the witness who constantine called
was de killer
of course
"My name is Shelly de Killer. I do some… odd jobs there and there."

wait whaaaaaaaaaa whoa major twist
Suure XD

He's denying he's the assassin
"But I assure you, there is nothing to fear. I do admit it’s quite an unfortunate name."
The court just accepts this
holy (B-Emoji)rap
So Winston beat the crud out of Shelly's testimony
And he turned into a radio

XD
Darn, I'd thought this trial was sensible.

"I may be old and my eyesight is failing me. But even I can see what happened. You just turned into a radio!"
Shelly: "…well, no point in denying it, is there? Yes. It’s true. I can turn into inanimate objects."
I love this case XD
And now he's telling his tragic backstory
With Hotel Dusk music playing in the background.

It's like this was made just for you.
XD
I actually started replaying it today, as a matter of fact.

Well, I'm not playing it myself for a while, so, no spoilers pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease thanks

:(
Please do.
Anyway holy crap Shelly turned into a barrel of beer and got inside the bar

Yeah, figured it would be case-relevant like that.
This is so intense.
This sure is well constructed.
hot damn
revisualisation but with payne's face
This is actually well made XD
The plot twist is Constantine used the phone to call the police
BUT DE KILLER WAS THE PHONE

[thinking emoji]
Because he can turn into inanimate objects, you see!
It all makes perfect sense!

Is this entire case just leading up to a "BUT WHO WAS PHONE" meme.
XD
Shelly was literally phone.
The proof is that Shelly escaped from the evidence table
Confirming he was phone.
Dang
But the motive is still unclear
Oh
But he was a hitman anyway
SOMEONE HIRED HIM TO DO THE JOB
AND IT WAS
LARRY HIMSELF?!

[thinking emoji]
Since he was a model in training, he couldn't have his face ruptured!
And when he was beat up, his face wasn't injured!
This is the conclusive proof!
And he did it so he could sue Gaspen and get rich!
Zvarri! The truth has elegantly revealed itself to me!
And he put sugar in Gaspen's beer so Oldbag could see them fighting, giving Gaspen a motive!
Ingenius!
shelly blew up
he admits everything

[O emoji][K emoji]
Awwwwwwwww
Gaspen made up with Winston
What an adorable moment
Just a bit of a brotherly squabble, amirite?
WHAT THE [Censored. Please be polite...]
THERE'S A HOLD IT EVEN AFTER THE CASE ENDS
OLDBAG HAS COME BACK
EVEN AFTER THE TRIAL
SHE HAS AN OBJECTION
According to her, people can't turn into inanimate objects!
Ludicrous!
She's claiming that none of this trial ever happened XD

...
"But who did this?! Who?!"
"You still don't know? It was you."
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
Oh dang, flashback to one year ago
Winston is attending his niece( Gaspen's daughter) Constance's birthday.
He gives her a present.
"I don't know much about technology and all but here it is: The all new Sunsong Nebula Note 8!"
They flash forward to one week later.
At Constance's funeral.
With the sad Hotel Dusk music playing again.
"How could anyone have predicted there would be an explosion where she went to?"
IT WAS THE PHONE
IT WASN'T A SUNSONG NEBULA NOTE 8
"It was Sunsong Nebula Note 7. A model that was withdrawn from the sale."
"Why, you may ask? It had a certain tendency that made it's battery explode."
WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111?!!?!?!?/
oLDBAG WASN'T A SECURITY GUARD
She was from a loony bin!
So after the incident, Winston started studying phones and stuff, which weirded out everybody
So he was taken to the mental asylum
"Are you implying I’m not real?! How rude of you, witness!"
"And secondly... I’ll never forgive you for ripping off Edgey-poo’s face for this cheap knock-off!"
Oh XD

Oh XD
The bartender isn't real.
His name is quite close to Payne's niece.
HOLY CRAP IT WAS ALL FORESHADOWED
oh
crap
so
basically
you have to lose at the final testimony
And the game ends
The End!

Well.
Okay.
Of course.

That's really it XD
I mean
Fine
It was still a 10/10 case though
Man that was fun
I need to play the actual winner of the "Best Worst Comp" now XD

Oh man XD
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Re: [CE][T][SoJ♫] Turnabout in Payne and Suffering ●

Post by DarthWiader »

You may have noticed neither the music nor the sounds were playing. Luckily, I've put them all back on. And in the process of doing so, I changed the credits music to something... a bit more fitting, so to say.
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Re: [CE][T][SoJ♫] Turnabout in Payne and Suffering ●

Post by Enthalpy »

Oh, hi everybody.
Spoiler : Much Belated Thoughts :
I replayed this, not remembering what case competition this had been submitted for. I started thinking this was a rushed case with a "quirky" sense of humor. I continued in my ignorance until after "you can drop off the Earth! ...that's a promise". Then it all came flooding back to me. This was a "So Bad It's Good" entry.

As a "So Bad" entry, the badness follows a weird curve. We start off with some jokes (the Scottish prosecutor theme, the damage to Larry's mojo, Winston being melodramatic about his reasons for going defense) that are there, but fall flat for me. Humor is very taste-sensitive, so I don't know whether this is just me or whether there is a lesson about comedy writing here. I think the jokes do little for me because they aren't used much after they're first told. Larry's mojo doesn't come up again, Payne's melodrama isn't built off of, and although we hear the prosecutor theme again, it's just retelling the same joke rather than developing or deepening it. But the game feels fairly normal for the next four cross-examinations. I wouldn't call the "contradiction" in Oldbag's testimony a real contradiction, mind you. Maybe Winston's waffling on the relevance of the phone call discrepancy was supposed to be a joke? The melodrama of the lobby conversation was, I think, supposed to be another joke, but I just end up clicking quickly through it. Then there's de Killer awkwardly saying "speakeasy," which is awkward but not funny.

The humor picks up at the reveal that de Killer can turn into inanimate objects, and then at de Killer was phone. That got a smile out of me! I think it would have gotten more if the rest of the case had been able to support it better, but it's still a good joke on its own.

That said, what I really loved about the case comes after the verdict. The reveal of what's really been going on. Although Gaspen's words are harsh, he does have a point that Winston has been on a downward spiral. It's a surprisingly believable scene, which makes the rest of the confrontation with Oldbag work, especially the reveal that Wilson was a robot and Winston's final breakdown.

So... you made a "So Bad It's Good" case that to me works better as a serious case for the end than a "So Bad It's Good" comedy. I'm confused, but I'm not complaining with an ending like that! For that alone, this case deserves some more attention!

(Also, I feel like Clooney Mental Asylum is a reference to some other case. Is it?)
[D]isordered speech is not so much injury to the lips that give it forth, as to the disproportion and incoherence of things in themselves, so negligently expressed. ~ Ben Jonson
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Re: [CE][T][SoJ♫] Turnabout in Payne and Suffering ●

Post by clcman »

Enthalpy wrote:
Spoiler : Much Belated Thoughts :
(Also, I feel like Clooney Mental Asylum is a reference to some other case. Is it?)
I think that is the place from Turnabout Substitution.
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Re: [CE][T][SoJ♫] Turnabout in Payne and Suffering ●

Post by Enthalpy »

Ah, I thought that might have been it. Thanks!
[D]isordered speech is not so much injury to the lips that give it forth, as to the disproportion and incoherence of things in themselves, so negligently expressed. ~ Ben Jonson
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