[T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

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Blackstein
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Blackstein »

The first case was fun, simple, but it was a good starting point.
Spoiler : Thoughts :
Although some contradictions are the same as some of the other games, it is difficult to think of contradictions, so it isn't really a complaint, just an observation.

But I must say that the last one, the one of Charles saying was a murder case when he couldn't know, I took a while to understand because I didn't read the right testimony, I even laughed a little when I realized how blind I was being.

Now I'm going to move on to the second case, which looks like it's going to be even bigger and better, at least that's what I hope.
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Blackstein »

Here they are, my thoughts on case 2.
Spoiler : Thoughts :
The investigation was kind of quick, but I like it when we don't spend a lot of time on those parts, at least when isn't the purpose of the case, because the court is often the part that really matters.

But it was still nice to see the characters and rub my badge in their faces whenever they appeared, unfortunately some had no reaction to that. :gumshoe:

Anyway, I think this is all from the first investigation.

Now we are in court and this scene with Apolo listing the times that Phoenix got hurt, together with saying that he punched him and it was "good times", that was gold.

"I'm not sure I like the way she's brandishing that whip ..."
Me neither...
How can we get a restraining order, guys?

"Aren't a lot of scientific theories based almost entirely on assumptions?"
He has a really good point.

I liked how we can continue the cross-examination, but I really thought it was better to give up, even so, would be kinda useless.

Apollo's reaction to Strickler was gold.
I even considered that it would be Kristoph for a moment, although it didn't make much sense to be him.

"More philosophical bull. Not what I was looking for."
It reminds me of philosophy classes at school.

"You should come with me... Hmmm... I can give you a... Hmmm... A private examination. Yes..."
Seriously, can't we really get a restraining order, guys? Like, now?!

It's nice to see the gallery helping to change the judge's opinion, I think there was only this one in the case with Redd White.

Interesting this final speech by Mags, I think he's right in some parts, but in Apolo's part, I think he's exaggerating a little.

Although Apollo suspected Talle at first, he still did everything to get the verdict of not guilty, even when everything seemed lost and when the defendant himself believed to be the murderer.

But you can see that Mags simply lived a life where even sees a second intention in people's efforts, or when someone has a moment of weakness it already defines his character.

Overall, was a great case, I really liked the contradictions and the characters.

Although, I think you missed a good opportunity to use this concept of a prosecutor being accused and the dark age of the law again in a case.

Where it could be ambiguous, or even Talle who killed Matt by accident, but in the end Apollo would have to decide what would happen, whether he was innocent, or guilty, something Farewell, My Turnabout style and with a similar price for the truth.

Of course, this would work much better in the last case, although that would also be interesting in the second case and the consequences in the third case.
I think that's all, now it's time to move on to case 3.
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Blackstein
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Blackstein »

Now it's time for my thoughts about A Turnabout of Chance.
Spoiler : Thoughts: :
I must say that the relationship between Apollo and Franziska is being very good to see.

Even more because until today we had few interactions between the characters of the original trilogy and the new trilogy.

That includes AJ, DD, and SOJ.

And when we have such an interaction, the writers end up taking it to total nostalgia and it doesn't even serve to bring something good or to develop such a relationship, just the old "oh, you're the Wright's apprentice, right?"

In the case of your series, this is very good to see.

I also think it's cool how Athena and Apollo's relationship is representing, I don't deny that I always liked the shipp between the two in the fandom, but even in a relationship as friends, they are the perfect pair.

Unfortunately, that leaves Trucy aside, but anyway.

Now talking about the mystery of the case itself, I found all the contradictions and how it led to the culprit very interesting.

Although I felt more pressure and even enthusiasm for the second case, but this was a good one too.

And now seeing all that happened with deKiller and now Charles ended up getting a verdict of not guilty...

I can't wait to see what you have in store for the following cases.
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by theimortal1974 »

i can't even complete case 1. i'm on the last testimony or the second to the last testimony. neither of the walkthrough solutions work (present missing case on 4th part or 5th part depending on which testimony i was on). i'm on the one where his theme song sounds terrible (really annoying over a long stretch had to mute the game).

regarding the walkthrough can i make a suggestion? it's very hard to sometimes tell which section i am in because all there are is the solutions. if you look at spoiler free walkthroughs for the main game series they always tell you what the testimony is called so you can tell where you are. and no i didn't use the walkthrough the whole time. just twice. if i had used it the whole time then where i was wouldn't of been a confusion. but other than this great first case and i'm looking forward to the others as well as your other work. you have a great writing talent.

edit: okay it finally worked using the missing file on the right statement but i tried that dozens of times before and it didn't work. i had to open the case up in the editor to find out what to do. then when i tried again it worked.
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Blackstein »

Already starting to write my thoughts while playing the extra case.
Spoiler : Thoughts: :
Payne... did you lose to Payne?! Is this serious?! How guilty and obvious did your client have to be to lose to Payne?!

"Hell, you even lost against Payne..."
DAMN RIGHT, NESS!

"If I did get locked up, I sure as hell wouldn't hire you to defend me."
Karma is a big B, isn't it, Ness?

"Either the prosecution's case is airtight, or the guy is so clearly guilty that even I know he did it."
It's not like you have a choice, bro, you have to defend the client, even if he's guilty, that's the purpose of having a fair defense. I mean, if you're Phoenix, then things change a little. :hobo:

"And back to the awkward silence."
I think you did pretty well.

"I like your badge."
LET'S GOOOOOO BROOOOO! She likes the badge, she likes the man!

"As long as justice is served, the world becomes a better place."
You clearly have a good heart, I hope nothing happens to you...

"My number."
I think it isn't all loses and regrets... wait... regrets... oh shit, she's gonna die, or something, right? I'm already seeing that coming!

"Hmm..."
I know where we going, but I can see he's not a bad guy like I thought... I just hope he finds his way after all this mess.

"No way... I don't believe it."
Neither do I... this is gonna be tough, buddy.

"Didn't Mags say something similar to that last night as well?"
That doesn't mean he wanted to say the same thing, Ed.

"3... 2... 1... Hit it!"
Nooooo, not again!

"They let somebody this nuts be a detective?!"
Don't question the police logic, Ed... because there isn't any logic at all!

"Something's fishy here..."
Well, well, if we don't have a Sherlock Holmes here.

"The investigation report mentions no such thing!"
This feeling is so strange, but I like it! It's not the usual "yeah, I got the contradiction", it's something more... "there's the way to lie like a dog and protect the guilty one." Even so, I'm liking the way this is going.

"It could only have been..."
No, no, no, no, no... I take back what I said! Come back! I don't want to do this!

"But you couldn't have known that just from looking at it! You had to have held it!"
Wait, so he's really guilty of something...? I'm confused.

"Are you telling the truth, witness?"
I don't really know what's the truth, but I don't think he's guilty either... but I'm liking this feeling of doubt, reminds me of the third case of The Great Ace Attorney.

Ness, you mother... argh... we have to go and explain things to Faith!

No... Faith... God damnit!

I have no words to describe this feeling... it's exactly what he's feeling, right? Man, this was insane and an excellent case and... WAIT, PHOENIX!? WHAT ARE YOU DOING HERE!?

NO, NO, NO! I'm gotta know how this gonna end!

Case 4...

LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.
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Blackstein
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Blackstein »

LET'S GOOOOOOOOOOO!
Spoiler : Thoughts (this one is a loooong journey): :
".....Just a nightmare"
I will take this chance to say Apollo isn't my favorite character without a reason, regards the whole bull of Dual Destinies and Spirit of Justice (which didn't happen in this series), he has a really good development by his own way.

He doesn't need a backstory to make him what he is. He's the guy who said "I'm fine", so he won't be afraid of tomorrow. He's the guy who had the mentor turn to be one of the cruelest and devilish people in the world, not by influence and neither spot on society, but by simply destroying other people's life.

And that still made a mark on him, but Dual Destinies and even Spirit of Justice just throw that away. Just like the whole development of Phoenix, turning him into a rookie attorney again, just having the fame and not the skills. Damn Capcom, stop hearing those nostalgic fanboys of the trilogy and let the characters grow, they can't be the same forever.

Sorry for the outburst, but you are doing 10 times better than the writers of the official games and that makes me angry at how the current games don't show a plot as well elaborated as yours and neither as many other creators in the AAO.

Geez, well, let's continue playing.

"It doesn't look like he's coming."

Like, this part of the plot it's something that any of the official games haven't even brought up. Athena doesn't even know the whole story between Apollo and Phoenix, she doesn't know what happened in Turnabout Trump, or even about Kristoph.

I know she doesn't really need to know that because got nothing to do with it, but that would be a good way to show why Apollo doesn't trust his soul to Wright because he betrayed him somehow and Athena has the right to know why her co-worker doesn't trust everything on their boss.

That the two can end up being on opposite sides. Not because there's something else forcing the two to be in such debate, but because they just don't trust each other in the end.

"I also have permission to share information on the case if I deem it necessary."
They also tried to make that position being something useful in DD and SoJ, but, honestly, Edgeworth was just helpful in DD, and wasn't so much since Wright needed to solve the whole thing. Although Edgeworth didn't have real influence in Khura'in, so it's understandable.

"Considering the kind of corruption surrounding the syndicate, I wouldn't be surprised."
And with that other judge, things will go even worse, we need to put them in check before Mags and Tristan got wild free too.

"A person cannot be put on trial for the same crime after they were declared innocent."
Sadly, that law applies to that bastards too, so Fuzz is free of those charges.

"Charles Fuzz is innocent. He cannot be tried in court a second time."
Exactly what I said!

"But instead I've had to dedicate all of my time to dealing with the aftermath of the Red Co. case."
To win something, we must lose something else, that's the law of equivalent exchange.

"A killer? Whatever happened to "innocent until proven guilty?"
You must be in the wrong universe, Ed, here is "guilty until proven innocent".

Please, Ed, do the right thing this time...

"Welp. Not my problem."
Oh, you son of a...!

"Yes. It is."
No. It isn't.

"...Okay."
Trucy is another character that the most recent games haven't give a damn to development right.
She has a really dark past with the whole thing of her mother and father, don't to mention Kristoph and her new father's actions.

Now, everything is going down, Wright is her safe spot and is missing. Athena doesn't count because they have lived just some time together. While Apollo and Trucy have something stronger because of what they passed and because they're siblings, although Wright didn't tell them.

And that's proven by what Athena, who is someone that knows very well about psychology, thinks...

"Please come back soon. Trucy needs you..."

"Where am I...?"
... where he is?! How?! When?! Argh! EDWARD! You dog! I really hope you don't have a finger on this!

Let's go to Part 2.

I liked the references and how Edgeworth knows so well de Killer, it's kinda a relationship of Sherlock vs Jack the Ripper.

And it's interesting how Shay and Apollo have some traits in common, mainly this thing of the two thinking they have to be the lone wolf.

"Damnit. I'm not about to give up here."
Neither am I, Apollo, we gonna find the truth, Shay can't do this alone.

"Huh?! How the heck did you find out about that so fast?!"
We have our ways, Ema.

"How about I just text you the address and we can discuss things in person?"
This isn't smelling good... to be honest when any murder case smell good, right?

"You'll need to wait here, though. Don't go anywhere."
Why police officers are always so rude?

"It..."
No, no, no... please, wasn't Wright, or Edward...

"It was Detective Charles Fuzz."
Oh... ... ... yeah... that's bad... I guess? I really don't feel much empathy for this guy, especially after what he has done so far.

"Mr. Apollo! I'm sorry, I didn't mean to startle you!"
Now Pearls gonna join the bunch?!

"Pearl really does have the power to channel the spirits of the dead."
BRO! She's gonna channel some spirit? That would be of great help, but I know that won't happen, would be too easy.

"Heh. Optimism. I had almost forgot what it sounded like."
You're too into this dark side of the law, Apollo, you need a break.

"Please. Take this."
Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat? A magatama? Well, that was unexpected.

"These people are natural-born liars, no wonder they haven't been tensing up."
A good excuse for not putting the Perceive into action. Cuz' I know that would be really hard, I even have tried sometimes in the trial manager.

"Finally! Somebody who appreciates true comedic talent!"
Yeah, right, I bet Pearls just know how to react with this sense of humor of the lawyers.

"Athena isn't my...! Ugh..."
That's not even the problem here, but okay...

That was some tough psyche-locks...

"I couldn't believe it when I heard what my brother did."
That's tough, buddy...

"But... Is there a different reason that you took this case?"
Who needs magatama when got a woman's senses to know a man from the inside?

Ok, wasn't her senses but WOW! 5 Psyche-Locks, Apollo?! I mean, I think it's fair considering Pearls doesn't know about Kristoph, at least I think she doesn't know, but even so...

Welp, let's go to the trial.

"In fact, how about I show you just how good I'm feeling!"
And we started with the wrong step...

"But after spending yesterday out with Pearly, you've actually begun to act like yourself again."
As I said, womans senses these changes on man.

"I'm fine. And I'm not just saying that either."
So, by knowing that he had Psyche-Locks, Apollo was able to break them himself... interesting.

"My personal goals shouldn't have been a part of it."
Look at my boy, how he grew up in these months. :apollo:

"Instead, my only drive should be the trust that I have in my client."
Yeah, but don't trust too much in others, okay? We don't wanna say farewell to our turnabout as Phoenix did.

"I just... can't believe that I was able to forget something as simple as that."
As I said in other comments, you have to believe, unconditionally, in your client because they have to have a fair defense.

"Where's the prosecution?"
Oh no... that doesn't look good.

"I apologise for my lateness, Your Honour."
Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?

"We're up against THE Miles Edgeworth?!"
I hoped to be some corrupted prosecutor, but Edgeworth really makes more sense.

"Whatever you need, sir!"
God, I know he's famous but cmon, can you be less fanatic?

"It's like he's a completely different person when he's standing in court."
He has to be, Apollo, it's his job, and better we do our before it's too late.

"Hey! Who's the defence attorney here?!"
First, he steals your contradiction, what gonna be next?! Your girlfri- I mean, your co-worker?!

"Sheesh, Apollo! You must be really off your game if you let that one slip past you."
But we... he... argh! This is not gonna be like that, let's poke his eye with your hair, Apollo!

"Watching the two of you argue back and forth like that reminded me of the good old days..."
Same here, Judge.

"You were actually kinda cool just now..."
You got a point with her, bro, don't you dare to mess up.

"...like the look of somebody who knows they've already won!"
We need to do that look too, need to be confident, that's the way to victory.

"This court finds the defendant, Shay Dee..."
Wait, what I heard before that was the sound of a psyche-lock breaking?

Wait... we actually... lost?! WHA- WHA- WHAT?! OKAY! THAT WAS INSANE!

"I see... So that's why you came down here."
Back to Phoenix, huh? Well, I think that won't change the result of the trial now, sadly...

"Sorry, Trucy."
Well, you couldn't do much, she wouldn't let you go if you didn't fool her... let's trust this was for the best.

"I'm not talented. I'm not special. I'm not a player in this game."
... hearing that... I dunno, there's a little bad feeling on my chest, because a bunch of lawyers is like him, Grossberg, and others... but that isn't an excuse for doing what you have done, Ed.

"Where am I...?"
So that's what happened, seems the two had a long journey.

"Surely that should prove to you just how capable they are."
That's the thing that gives me more anger about Phoenix being back as an attorney. Because he didn't need to come back. He was better acting like a lone wolf, or even turning into a detective, but putting that badge on his chest just made him a rookie again.

"The best thing you can do for those two is to be there to support them, no?"
Exactly! Support, but that didn't need to him be an attorney again.

"Apollo... He probably doesn't trust me. And I don't really blame him."
Sit down and learn with this guy, Capcom, that's how we make true character development.

"Don't just stand there! Take it!"
I'm not crying... you're crying! DAMN NOSTALGIA! :cry:

Part 5, let's go.

"You have my thanks, Your Honour."
Saved by the bell!

"I feel like I'm babysitting a couple of kids..."
Know what is like.

"Well, well... It's so good to see you all again..."
You can't be serious, Edgeworth. THIS GUY?

"Happy Ema is making me uncomfortable. Bring back Grumpy Ema."
Hell yeah!

"Marlow Dee was given the death penalty for a murder that never even happened!"
God damn it... if the idea was to make the judicial system being trustworthy after that line, Apollo, you surely didn't a good job on that. But I'm must say that I'm shocked.

"What I say here and now runs the risk of throwing the entire legal world in to chaos..."
Interesting how I mention that idea of the actions of the defense may risk the whole thing of the dark age of the law to happen again and here we are, I see you were saving that idea for this trial, good writing on that.

"End of Part Five."
I couldn't even say something with all the exciting plot into my face, bro! Let's go to the last act!

"Oh, come on. That's really not necessary."
Of course, it is, man! What you did was basically dismantling almost an entire crime empire! Involving the court, gangsters, and millionaires!

"I would never pass up the chance to see such a fascinating individual at work!"
I'm getting vibes of a Batman and Joker relationship here...?

"That's why it was so fascinating for me to witness the world through his eyes."
Everything that Franziska described is practically what Apollo is and what makes me like him so much, but of course, SoJ had to put a backstory about his father and everything, as if it wasn't enough what we had in AJ.

"There's something I've been meaning to tell the two of you for a while now."
DON'T EVEN JOKE ABOUT THAT, PHOENIX!

And with this incredible remix made by sheddy, I finally finished Beyond the Shadows... my heart couldn't be warmer after this epilogue, I don't know if this was the best series you made, but I'll surely remember it well, so, thank you Gizmological.

Of course, during these comments, I only focused on the good part of every case, I never complained about some minimal and technical errors I've seen, that maybe have been caused by me when I click too fast, but now it's irrelevant, just wanted too in the hype to say something.

Well, I'll look forward to playing any new case you would make in the future.
theimortal1974
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by theimortal1974 »

case 2 court part 1 has a lot of graphical glitches. the background scene loading without the character at first. the first time it happened i thought apollo was hiding from the whip. also when you present a contradiction to the secretary's testimony she appears all the way on the right side of the screen and you can only see half of her. nothing game breaking but i thought i'd mention it.
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Mathias_Trueman »

I'm having an issue loading Case 2 - Investigation 2. The initial loading screen shows the Audio bar fill up, but the Image bar never appears. Refreshing/Reloading does not seem to resolve the issue, and it doesn't seem to be happening to other parts of the series that I try to load.

I have been enjoying the series so far! Hopefully this can be resolved soon.
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Gizmological
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Gizmological »

Mathias_Trueman wrote: Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:47 pm I'm having an issue loading Case 2 - Investigation 2. The initial loading screen shows the Audio bar fill up, but the Image bar never appears. Refreshing/Reloading does not seem to resolve the issue, and it doesn't seem to be happening to other parts of the series that I try to load.

I have been enjoying the series so far! Hopefully this can be resolved soon.
That would be this bug again. Should be fixed for now, let me know if you run into any more problems.
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Mathias_Trueman »

Thanks for the quick response, and the quick fix! The case loaded just fine now, glad that this bug was easy enough to work around.
Heather Chandelure
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Heather Chandelure »

Ive been wanting to replay this game recently, but there is a large number of broken music files. i tried it anyway, but in both cases 1 and 2 tracks frequently just diddnt play. im on firefox, so i know thats not the issue.
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by SuperAj3 »

Heather Chandelure wrote: Mon Jan 22, 2024 10:00 pm Ive been wanting to replay this game recently, but there is a large number of broken music files. i tried it anyway, but in both cases 1 and 2 tracks frequently just diddnt play. im on firefox, so i know thats not the issue.
AAO requires its users to upload assets themselves. Given the last reply in this case's thread was from 3 years ago, it's quite possible the links have since died/been deleted and it will be up to the case's creator to reupload them. IDK how active they are but a case with no replies from 3 years may have been lost to time.
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Re: [T] AA: Beyond the Shadows ●●●●●

Post by Gizmological »

Boo.

From what I can tell the links are still up and working.
If anyone can verify that they're getting the same issue I'll put aside some time to look into it.
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